in
his own words
by Mike Crawford
Builder started as a band in the spring of 1994 with me (Mike) and Pete jamming in Pete's parents Oak Cliff, Texas home. They didn't seem to mind the noise; Pete said they had gotten so used to him drumming over the years that they just turned the TV up while we rocked out in the back room. I met Pete while I was playing with The Spin and he was playing with Rumble in Dallas, Texas. We met up again at a mutual friend's (Kyle Ragsdale) art show opening party. Pete said if I ever wanted to do anything in a more Christian vein than what I was doing he would definitely be interested. So a couple years later I ended up calling. Anyway, it was just me and Pete playing a few tunes I had written since the Spin had broken up. We jammed that way for three months or so, whenever Pete wasn't busy playing with Jack Ingram. We got in contact with a bass player named Kyle Compton (Kyle where are you?) who was atUTA getting his undergrad pre-med schooling done. He had a PA set up in the house he was staying at so it turned out to be a great place to practice. I ran into Jim Cocke at a huge Bible study, led by Tommy Nelson, called Metro. Jim was just getting out of Davíd Garza's band in order to stay closer to home and his new wife Teresa. I told him about what Pete and I were doing and he told me if we ever needed some rockin' B3 to give him a call. I thought that sounded cool so Jim started coming to rehearsals and the band was born. We played only four or five shows over the course of that summer and fall. But then that Fall God opened up a job in Kansas City for me and as much as I hated to leave the band, I knew God wanted me to move. So that was the end of Builder. Pete would talk to me every once in a while and tell me what a great spiritual experience being in Builder was and we would talk about all the what ifs but that was all just talk...
Until the spring of 1998. I had been recording some of the Builder songs in my basement and my folks-in-law pressed up a hundred or so cds of that stuff for me for Christmas 1997. I sent the cds out to old friends and fans of the Spin just as a little art project. It wound up in the hands of a couple of good friends from Baylor who had started the Flat Earth Record label. They asked if they could release the cd to a wider audience but they wanted to use the Builder guys instead of drum machines, etc. We had lost contact with Kyle Compton, so.... five years later we found ourselves sort of a band again. A band in two different cities and with no bass player. Easter of 1998 I headed down to Dallas with la famalia and recorded the basic drum tracks for the new Builder cd at Martin Baird's house studio in Dallas. We ended up having to borrow Course of Empire's ADAT machines because Martin was running Tascams and the studio where I would be doing all of the overdubbing/ mixing in Kansas City was ADAT. We recorded the drums in 2 days. (I have spent more time than that just trying to get drum sounds!) I brought the tapes back to KC and spent my spare time that summer (spare time!?! - what's that??? .... ) recording the guitars, bass, and vocal parts at Keith Kaster's Ashland Studios. I sent the tapes back to Jim in Dallas sometime in September. He recorded Hammond B3, Wurlitzer, piano, accordion, and melodica at Crystal Clear studios in Dallas. I got the tapes back in November and started transfering everything over to ProTools so we could do the mixing. Finally, after months of mixing and re-mixing, the cd, spring sprang sprung, is done. Although this cd has been a long time coming, I think that the feel remains loose and not overworked. Most of the takes were 1st or 2nd, and there are many mistakes to be found. But hey, that's what makes music interesting is the mistakes! You will find a broad range of influences and styles on spring sprang sprung, everything from mellow acoustic to thickly saturated rock. Les Paul through a Mesa, Hammond B3 through a big ole Leslie, $25 Hagstrom with the Naugahyde ON (Waco Texas pawnshop prize!) through a Fender Deluxe, $50 Wurlitzer with the tremolo ON, plastic recorder from fifth grade music class with Mr. Rane, Yamaha acoustic stolen/kidnapped from my wife Laura, stinky old Fender Jazz Special bass through the SansAmp, Pete's four piece kit hit HARD and soft, vocals sung with emotion and left with all the untrained stuff for everyone to hear, Laura singing sweetly (la, la, lalala's), piano pounding, even some calculator talking! Lyrically the thing ranges from Holy Ghost sightings to love letters, from the River of Lust to the Sea of Love, from Dreaming to Stealing, from the devil ('ole saden) to Jesus, from puzzling hearts to relentless hands (of Time that is....).
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An interview/conversation between
Builder's Mike Crawford,
and former Plebians bandmember Steve Collins
When we approached Builder frontman Mike Crawford about granting a Communiqué interview, he came back with a creative idea -- to let another musician handle the interviewing and to make it a casual, conversational affair. Enter Steve Collins, former member of Dallas-based The Plebians. We like creative ideas... and what follows is the outworking of their exchange. If you're new to Mike Crawford, Builder (or his previous band The Spin), read the sidebar to bring you up-to-speed, and to find out how to get the as-yet unreleased Builder recording spring sprang sprung, which is also reviewed In The Changer.
Steve Colllins: First of all - why have you been away from doing records for so long?! I just want you to know, we've missed you in recorded form.
Mike Crawford: That's actually not a bad starting question. I've really been working on this cd for a couple of years now. I've been living in the real world; working, doing the family thing. All of that takes up so much of my time. So I've been working constantly but no one has really known about what I've been up to. I am really glad this thing is finally going to be released. I've got enough songs to do another cd right now. I guess I'd better get started if I hope to get it out before the next decade is up!
Collins: So this record has taken a while - when did you start on it?
Did you set out to make a record? Or were you just experimenting?
Crawford: I actually started writing some of these songs about 6 or 7 years ago, right after The Spin broke up. One of the songs on the cd was from even before that. It was written during 1990; the Lonely Max era for any Spin fans. We never even rehearsed it though. So this is really a pretty old cd song-wise, but I think the songs still stand up. They are pretty classic in their structure and sound so they will stay around a while I think. As far as the actual recording of spring sprang sprung, it started Easter weekend 1998. I just finished mixing in September 1999. So it's taken a year and .... That may seem strange in the conventional world of recording a cd in two weeks or whatever, but I have been trying to do this in my spare time. With a full time job and a wife and two kids there is really not much in the way of "spare" time! I am really adamant about not sacrificing my wife & kids on the altar of music! Or of anything else for that matter.
Collins: That's good news! - Unfortunately all too uncommon in the music world.
Crawford: My whole intention with this thing was to get some of these songs out in some form. More of an independent art project than anything else. So I recorded these songs in my basement and through the grapevine they got to Flat Earth Records and they asked me if I would like to re-record them with my old band Builder and of course I said YES!
Collins: In listening and comparing to some earlier records, songs you wrote for The Spin, it seems that now you've taken a more direct approach with the message and lyrics in Builder. Was this something you set out to do or just developed?
Crawford: I think you can hear a transition in the last couple of Spin records. I was all into metaphysics and new age and lots of other non-Christian philosophies of life during the Lonely Max period. I knew about Jesus but was at a point where I was searching and trying to find my own way, as opposed to some faith that was just my parents' or whatever. I think a lot of people go through that during their college years. I guess it's one of many processes God uses to make your faith your own. I started growing in my faith as a Christian during the Motherlode period. I think this Builder cd is a step further in the direction of maturing in Christ. It is all so much clearer now what the Truth is, what is really real. I suppose it's a part of growing up in Christ. So I guess the directness just sort of developed. Probably more like I've developed and the songs have come right along with me.
Collins: Yeah, Motherlode had a definite movement toward God or The One, as some of the songs say. But with Builder you seem to have arrived at a different plane. "Trying to find a friend of mine" as you say on the record. Seems you've found Him here.
Crawford: Yeah, you know who that friend is though?
Collins: I think I do...
Crawford: That friend is actually an old musician friend of mine.
Collins: yeah . . .could you elaborate.
Crawford: The song you are talking about is called The Sower.
Collins: Yeah, and for the first time, I'm seeing it I think.
Crawford: I am referring to looking for where a good friend of mine is with his life in Christ. I'm just wondering where he stands spiritually.
Collins: Man, that song just hit home for me. Personal stuff here too.
Crawford: Sometimes, I wondered if it was a waste of time to speak with him about the things of God, but over time, I realized that some are to sow and some are to reap. I may never know where he or anyone else stands, but that's not my job (to know), only to speak the truth... I still think about a lot of my long lost friends and wonder what is up in their lives spiritually. I think that is totally the Holy Spirit prompting me to pray for them, so sentimentality does me and my job as an intercessor some good! I get to pray for old friends when I remember "the good old days."
Collins: Yeah, I know how you feel...I've got a friend like that...It seems like, when you play in bands, the members go through a lot of great and hard times - and then when it's over - you've got some of those emotional - and creative ties drifting - you've still got that bond, that friendship thing lingering, and it kinda haunts you. Did that kind of stuff influence your writing at all?
Crawford: Definitely. The song Perception has a lot to do with that.
Collins: Can you talk a bit about that?
Crawford: Yeah. The Spin did have quite a rocky ending, but in the middle of that ending God was really changing me and my life. The song Perception is me wondering what other people who were close to me thought of what was going on with me & God.
Collins: How did your life change?
Crawford: I had an artist friend who was really living with and for Christ. His friendship really influenced me a lot. His name is Kyle Ragsdale. Kyle actually had some art posted here on the Communique web site last year. Through him, I saw what it meant to have a personal relationship with Christ instead of just a Sunday-morning-only kind of relationship with Him. Just hanging out with Kyle and being in a small group of believers that were artists and musicians was really good for me. We had a really cool little Bible study that helped me grow a lot. I was also going down to visit Laura while she was finishing up at Baylor. I would go on Sunday night and stay through Tuesday morning. On Monday nights we went to a really neat worship/study time called Choice. It was about 1,400 college kids singing and worshiping God and studying His word. The Passion movement started out of that. Louie Giglio was the leader at Choice and though Laura and I will probably never meet him, he was one of the most influential people for us during that critical time in our spiritual lives.
Collins: That's interesting subject matter, cause it does hit home with a lot of people. Could you talk about the "perception" part of it? How these life changes appeared to the people around you -
Crawford: Yeah, we're always worried about what everybody else thinks about us!
Collins: yeah!
Crawford: Probably not the most healthy attitude but a real one... That is definitely one of my big struggles in life, always wondering what people are thinking of me, how they perceive me.
Collins: It's interesting how you address this heavy stuff in such a melodic/major key sort of way. Your music has always been so optimistic. If it were me writing it, it'd be all - A Minor - but you're right there doing it with the best attitude! I dig it.
Crawford: That's funny you should mention that. My mom thinks my words are so, I don't know, melancholic. But yeah, I think I'm always trying to write lyrics that "hit the nail on the head" with music that uplifts your soul. I always try to roll the hope of Christ into the mix too. The good news should always be the hope that overshadows all the struggle of life. What is it in Romans that Paul says? Something like, "I consider my present sufferings not even worthy of comparing to the glory that will be revealed in us." It's like yeah, life is full of trouble but just keep your eyes set on Heaven! It seems to lighten the load for me.
Collins: yeah, I dig that. It's quite a contrast sometimes - but a great one.
Crawford: Lately though, in my old age, the music is getting a little sadder too. I think the next record will be a bit different.
Collins: How so?
Crawford: Well, I hate to speculate and talk about that since this one is just out but...I think I've grown up a lot.
Collins: Can you elaborate a bit about that ... the difference between where you were and where you are...
Crawford: Somehow, music mellows a little when you have kids upstairs sleeping and your wife is upstairs sleeping and you're not touring the country in a smelly old van with 4 other guys. Also, Builder right now is not really a band per se. We exist in two different cities 500 miles apart. I'm in Kansas City and the other guys are still in Dallas. So a lot of the newer stuff is written on acoustic, late at night, etc. I still have a lot of the "little kid with a new distortion pedal" in me though. We are going to try to do some shows in Dallas, so you will definitely see some of that then. Who knows, maybe that will spur on more rocking. I love that contrast. Loud guitars and mellow acoustics all on the same record, I'm definitely a fan of variety. Sometimes though, a record will work better if all of it is mellow or vise versa. What do you think? Speaking of mellow - Have you heard the new Innocence Mission? It's truly an incredible disk.
Collins: Yeah I agree, The new Innocence Mission is Brilliant! I love "SNOW"! I love that song. But I'd like to ask you . . .The music scene in general is cynical nowadays. America has become very cynical in recent years it seems - and it seems to be in style. How is Builder going to work with that and or combat it? This versus when The Spin was playing, optimism was still going strong in music. Optimism among the music listeners as well - how do you think Builder and the music will do in today's market - or do you even stop to think? I personally have been looking for more optimism in popular music. The Innocence Mission plays into that brilliant optimism and the joy of sad feelings - Is that something you think you'll explore?
Crawford: Well, I don't know if I totally agree with you on the "back in the early nineties everything was optimistic." I mean grunge was king and I think cynicism was definitely in vogue then as well. Even so, we always, I mean always, got positive comments about being happy, joyful, etc. I will tell you that I just can't help smiling when I'm playing, it's something God has given me that I love and that just pours out, especially playing live. I will continue to present what is in me, regardless of what is in vogue. I will continue to write about Truth as I see it played out in my life and relationships. I guess I am optimistic about that! I think other people want to hear songs about Hope and Truth.
I think a band that can present those things will be a breath of fresh air in such a cynical climate. I also think that there are enough young Christians who dig good music but are not given anything very creative from the CCM crowd. Seems everything is so pre-fab in the CCM market. We are anything but that. We are just trying to put out honest, positive songs with a bit of creativity. All this said, I do have a truly melancholic side, the artist in me. I do understand the positive side of sad feelings and even the enjoyment of sad music. So I suppose that is part of what we do as well. Did I just contradict myself there?
Collins: No not at all.
Crawford: ok, just checking...
Collins: I agree, now that I think about it - there was Nirvana and
stuff, but The Spin was a great band, and it was that great feeling you got about a "good" vibe that was different. I think that is very strong - so many performers get on stage and act as if they're bored to tears. Is this tradition of the "good" vibe something that continues with Builder?
Crawford: Yeah, I'm real into the positive vibe coming off the stage or out of the speakers. I want people to go "YEAH!" when they listen to a song like Taking My Time from our new cd. To identify with the lyrics about recognizing sin in your life and at the same time feel uplifted by the music. Even though the content lyrically is very heavy, the vibe is uplifting. I think the music can help the song clarify part of what it is trying to get across. In Taking My Time, the chorus is God saying He is taking His time with us as we recognize different sins within ourselves.
The process of sanctification may seem tedious, and no one but God and you may recognize the process. But the Christian life is just that, a lifelong process of growing in holiness. I think the music is trying to express the hope there in that chorus. God is in fact working in my life and there is hope, even if it seems slow.
Crawford: and that B-3 of Jim's always makes me go "YEAH" when I listen to that song!
Collins: Yeah - That song will make you do that. You're a very visual performer too - so when you hear a song like Taking My Time and see the performance - you walk away playing air guitar in slow motion.
Crawford: haha
Collins: I wanted to ask you about the instrumentation on the new cd. There seems to be a lot of experimentation with that on this record - the recorder, accordion, samples and other things -
Crawford: Do you want me to just elaborate about who played what?
Collins: I guess I'm just curious, did you walk into the studio and lay it down and or did the band just kind of fumble into doing a performance. The recorder and other instruments really add to some of the songs - separate them very well. When did you get the ideas to go out on limbs like that.
Crawford: The recorder is something I've had since 5th grade and always just messed around on. It's actually on the first Spin record, a song called Goodbye. Is that what it's called? I can't remember now. Anywho. Um, most of the little experimental noises were just ideas that would pop into my head and I would write them in my little journal as ideas to try.
Collins: haha - well that's a good technique. It's difficult to make
recorders and accordions work with popular music but you seem to pull it off. The accordion parts are great too - is that Jim playing?!
Crawford: Yeah, that's him on everything non-guitar except the recorder.
Collins: He really is a great player.
Crawford: All of Jim's piano/wurlitzer/accordion/melodica parts were
recorded without me present. He did them in Dallas after I had laid everything else down here. I just told him to do whatever he felt led to do. He brought all his goodies into the studio and just basically messed around. He is such a great player. I don't even think he had parts planned or anything when he went into the studio. He just started playing!
Collins: You played bass I suppose?
Crawford: Yeah, I played all the bass stuff. I actually love to play
bass! We kind of lost track of our old bass player. His name is Kyle
Compton. Hey Kyle, if you're out there somewhere, drop us a line!
Collins: Pete Coatney is your drummer - how was it working with Pete?
Crawford: Pete is a great player too. We had two days in Dallas to put down all his parts and that included getting sounds and everything. So he cut everything in first or second takes. That's how everything was done. First or second takes, so you don't get perfection, but you usually get a good feeling. The drumming is very solid if I could slide a compliment to Pete. Pete is a very meat & potatoes drummer. He's way into Charlie Watts and Ringo and Bun E. Carlos. It's like pulling teeth to get a fill on the toms from him but he is dead solid on the beat!
Collins: So I see you did all the production on this record - how was it producing your own music? Some people love it and others hate it. Did you get what you wanted to tape?
Crawford: For the most part I loved it. I got to do everything I wanted to do mix-wise. This is the first time I've mixed a record so there are definitely some kinks in there, but all in all I loved it. It's something I would like to get more into.
Collins: So were you cool with only getting to take one or two takes? I think that keeps it interesting. Daniel Lanois says that too much
perfection makes something "ornamental." Did you feel like that was the case here - that you got a good performance . . cause It sounds good here. You think the songs stand as you like them? Do they sound like they did in your head or did they develop past to a new point?
Crawford: I definitely don't think we got to the point of ornamental, but there is some production stuff on the cd. Background vocals/overdubs etc. It's not too over the top though. I think the sounds are nice enough and yet still have some of that organic homemade-soup sort of flavor. Definitely not some gourmet meal all delicately proportioned on a hundred-dollar plate. Homemade soup may not look as pretty but somehow it always tastes better than some gourmet dish. Sometimes I find myself trying to compare this cd to cd's done in big studios with big time budgets, and I don't think that's a very realistic or healthy way for me to think. God has been working on me there.
Collins: Well yeah, and then there's Springsteen's Nebraska - done in a house on 4 track. It doesn't get much better.
Crawford: So true, one of my favorite records. I don't think something has to sound polished to be good. And usually the unpolished stuff is more interesting to listen to anyway.
Collins: No you weren't ornamental here at all -- I think it's good as is. I was just saying, Sometimes - people get too mathematical with their music in the studio - and end up killing it. You didn't - it's sounds great. Humans aren't polished. My grandmother used to say "Well if they're too holy or too well dressed on a Saturday. . . you can't trust 'em." Haha
Crawford: What were you digging on the cd as you listened to it? Anything in particular stand out? If I could be so bold as to interview the interviewer! An outsider's perspective on the music would be good.
Collins: Well, I'm diggin on Taking My Time, The Sower, Heaven's Ghost - and Jesus Knockin right now.
Crawford: How would you describe the sound of Builder to the
uninitiated?
Crawford: Butt-Kicking Rock-n-Roll!?
Collins: Yeah!
Crawford: hahaha
Collins: haha
Collins: I love that thing you do - when it's total chaos - and then it's starts winding up like it's gonna punch you in the face, and then the snare hits and breaks it up to a full fledge rock song! I love that. Always have about your stuff - when I was about 17 I used to try and
write stuff like that based on listening to Spin records and stuff - nothing got my adrenalin pumping more. But all that came out was frustrated folk rock songs.
Crawford: Like on Taking My Time's bridge, when everything winds back up after the piano/vocal breakdown and then the B-3 pushes it over the edge into ROCK!!!!!!
Collins: Neil Young would be proud!
Crawford: It's like Beavis and Butthead time when that happens. I just want to hold my fist up in the air and yell "YEAH - ROCK ON MAN!"....
Collins: On the opposite end of the sonic spectrum, the guitar work on Jesus Knockin is really great! It has this quality you get on guitar - I can recall some tones that hit me on "Laurel Lane" - that little chimey Crawford Guitar - but here it's matured to something really special.
Collins: Is there a particular song on the record that moves you?
Crawford: Yeah, the couple of songs on the cd about Laura (my wife) are probably the most meaningful to me.
Collins: Which ones are those?
Crawford: Those would be Reverie and The Million Brilliance.
Crawford: They speak of the course of our relationship. We dated 5 1/2 years mostly long distance and in the beginning we were definitely not walking with God. I have no idea why she stuck with me but she did. I suppose God wanted it that way.
Collins: I know the feeling.
Collins: Yeah, The Million Brilliance is really great. That song has
been getting to me. It's very touching how you say "She is a million
brilliant things. . .that you will never see."
Crawford: Yeah, that song talks about being with someone that you have the opportunity to know better than anyone in the whole world will ever know them. She is The Million Brilliance that Shakespeare spoke of when describing the starry night. The story in my head about that song is that Laura is the nighttime sky and I am the only person allowed to go far out from the city lights and gaze at the millions of beautiful stars that adorn her. Laura is a million beautiful "things" that no one but me will ever see. It's like I'm bragging but in a positive way.
Collins: Did you find that writing something that personal was difficult?
Crawford: You know, I really didn't. Maybe, since our relationship is in such a good place now, it's easy to write about those situations. To look at the hard times and see how far God has taken us over the course of our relationship. That's mostly what those songs are about. Moving from hard times without God to good times with Him.
Collins: That's really cool. Can you talk about Reverie - what the
name means and etc. I've thought that title was interesting.
Crawford: Reverie is a word that means "a daydream-like state". I made up a place in my mind that was called Reverie. It's a metaphor for somewhere "good", somewhere you might daydream about being. I talk at first like it's just a place we were wishing we could be and really had never been there. I tell Laura in the chorus, "We'll go down to the riverside, Jump on in we're gonna take a little ride, Don't give up until we reach the other side, You and me in Reverie." The river is the trouble in this world or the trouble that you experience in a relationship. You are going to have to go through that river if you want to get to the other side. And it might be cold and moving really fast and it might seem impossible to cross but you have to jump on in and try if you are going to get to that place that you dream about. That place called Reverie. I truly believe Laura and I have gotten to that point in our relationship. I'm sure there are difficult times ahead, but we are so much on the same page that I am always just thanking God for taking us across that river and giving us the kind of marriage we have.
Collins: Man! That's so cool!
Collins: I think everybody's got a place like that - or I hope they do.
Crawford: Yeah, you really do need a place like that in a relationship. You at least need the hope that someplace like that exists.
Collins: Yeah that's true - it's water for the soul - Now tell me about
the song Hysteria. You've got mentions of Peter and America and all sorts of interesting stuff.
Crawford: This song is the oldest on the cd. It was written during the
Lonely Max sessions back in 1990.
Collins: Whoa. .. really. How did you choose it to be on this CD?
Crawford: The Spin never recorded it or even rehearsed it, just one of those that dropped though the cracks. I never forgot about it for some reason and when Builder started playing live I broke it out. I always liked the 6/8 sort of feel it has.
Crawford: There is a reference to the Dallas band Course of Empire and the Peter reference is Peter Schmidt from Three on a Hill and later Funland. He was one of the "founding fathers" of the music scene down in Dallas.
Collins: Really? That's interesting.
Crawford: If you listen real close you can hear me say "Peter Schmidt that is..." on the cd.
Collins: I don't know very much about C.O.E.'s music. Were you working a lot around them? Sounds like you were listening to their music a lot maybe?
Crawford: Course of Empire was blowing everyone away with their powerful sound, they had just released their first cd and I thought it just blew ours away. I was hoping for more power out of the Spin but we weren't writing like that yet. We eventually came around!
Collins: yeah - you did. You got some power going.
Crawford: Those were just the people in the scene in Dallas at the time, so I though them into the mix of my little song. It's one of those songs that I can't really pin down lyrically, it was more just stream of consciousness.
Collins: Those were the bands that kind of developed it - Three on A
Hill, The Rev. Horton Heat, Shallow Reign, Course of Empire, New
Bohemians, Pop Poppins, and The Spin definitely - And those groups influenced each other and a scene. So this is cool stuff for those who are familiar with that era of the Dallas music scene. Especially if you know what the references are. But this song stands out on it's own. "Come on come on come on . . ."
Crawford: I like having that song near the end of the record because I like the outro, the "Come on, Come on with me" part. It's like you've heard all that I have said on the cd so I'm inviting you to walk with Christ like I am - or maybe it's like Christ is actually speaking and saying "Come on with Me!"
Collins: Yeah - I hear that - that's a cool way to do it.
Crawford: Then, the time is open for a song like Jesus Knocking.
Collins: This is very, what I like to call "Crawford-esque". You have
certain things that are very signature.
Crawford: What, the "come on, come on" part? Sort of that high pleading sound.
Collins: - yeah the Come On part - I know about "Crawford-esque"
because I used to try and write in a Crawford-esque on my songs when I was in high school. Also that tremolo ending is so pretty on this version of Hysteria.
Crawford: You like?
Crawford: I really dug that part - definitely a keeper.
Collins: Yeah -that part has a cool sound to it. Now Jesus Knocking, I
don't know if we talked about this one yet - but it is just great.
Crawford: No, we haven't.
Collins: The High Guitar part is great there - To me this is an older Mike Crawford - because this guitar part you do here is unique to you. I can hear the chiming of "Laurel Lane" in it - but now with the security of an adult with confidence.
Collins: But that guitar sound is there - what is it you're using here?
Crawford: All the acoustic parts are Laura's Yamaha acoustic. It's a
real nice sounding guitar. We put the mike wwwwaaaaaayyyyyy back to get that far away sound. That's why you hear all that hiss and air noise.
Collins: I really love room sounds. Sounds great.
Crawford: I thought it just added instead of being a negative.
Collins: It did - definitely.
Crawford: That song came to me very quickly - like I just sort of sat there and sang the whole thing. This has never happened to me before or since.
Collins: They say that's one of the coolest ways to write. I read an
interview with Sting and he said he wrote "Fields of Gold" in like 10
minutes. And that is one of my favorite songs.
Crawford: Jesus Knocking took about that long to write. It was like, sit
down and sing it and write as fast as you can!
Collins: and feel . . and don't think.
Crawford: Yeah, definitely. Let the Main Man do all the thinking!
Collins: Yeah, you got it.
Collins: Well, like Fields of Gold, this song is very poignant and
beautiful.
Crawford: thanks.
Collins: Now lets talk about Taking My Time. This is a narrative,
right?... about secret sin?
Crawford: The realization of Sin in my life. And of nobody knowing about it. Yeah, that's right. A narrative for everyone. So it's not only
personal, but also universal.
Collins: Yeah, so Lust/Pride/etc comes into view here on this one - and that is a big problem for all people.
Crawford: The man inside the man. In I Cor. 2:11 it says, "Who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the man's spirit within him?" It's so easy to appear like you have it all together on the outside, but having it together on the inside is where it really counts. I think everyone struggles with that whether it be lust, pride, hate, greed, covetousness, whatever. We can't get away from ourselves. I think when we start to realize how much God hates those kinds of things is when we can start to let Him work on them in our lives.
Collins: When you sing "I'm taking my time" - what are you talking
about there?
Crawford: Ok, this part is not as clear as maybe it should be. The
chorus of the song was actually written first and then the rest filled in
around it. Sometimes I just let a song be and then try to get the meaning later - sort of let the words tell me what they are trying to say.
Collins: I've got ya. It's funny - cause meaning pops out at you when taking that approach. Sometimes you might write a song that you think is totally incoherent, just rambling, and then you let somebody hear it and they make a comment about what they think your saying -and then things come into focus - don't you think?
Crawford: Yeah, I think it just took some time of sitting on this one to get some meaning out. So what I have discovered is that in the chorus, God is speaking, saying, "I'm taking My time." He is taking His time as He works on the sin within us and sometimes He moves slowly and sometimes it seems that nobody knows that He is changing you. I guess the idea of taking it slow means He is patient with us and is willing to give us His grace and change us slowly over time. Bringing us ultimately to the place where we are holy just as He is holy. Just as nobody knows the "trouble in me", nobody knows how God might be working on my heart.
Collins: Yeah that makes sense. Well now, Son of A Gun . . .I could
give you a million interpretations of what I think this song could mean. I'd like to ask you about it.
Crawford: I'd be interested to hear what someone else thinks, could you give me an interpretation?
Collins: Well for one, I hear some of the Abraham & Isaac thing going. And then I hear a personal thing going - about your family - You and Cole and Laura. But you wrote this before Cole was born right?
Crawford: Yeah, this song was actually written a couple of years before we had Cole. It was me remembering what my dad was like and thinking on what would be like to have a son. And then the Abraham/Issac God/Jesus thing just sort of naturally flowed out of that.
Collins: Your father passed away when you were pretty young I guess?
Crawford: Yeah - I was 20 or 21
Collins: So that makes a lot of sense. This is a cool song about that.
How does it feel now to hear the song you wrote about being a son and wondering about having one now that you are a father?
Crawford: Really accurate
Collins: Yeah . .
Crawford: Yeah - could I give my son for a people who did not care about me? Probably not - Definitely not! That's why God is God.
Collins: yeah that's very true.
Crawford: I cannot understand the level of faith in Abraham. Truly
supernatural.
Collins: My dad tells me that there is no feeling in the world like
being a parent.
Crawford: He is correct! I love my kids so much - I would sound like a bumbling idiot if I tried to describe it to you!
Collins: hahahahah - You've got a boy and a girl right?
Crawford: Yeah - Cole is fixing to turn 4 and Macyann just turned 2 in September. They are out in the backyard with their mom jumping into big piles of leaves. (Ahh - Autumn in Kansas City!)
Collins: Did you think music would come back this strong into your
life?
Crawford: It has sort of snuck back up on me.
Collins: When did it start it's creeping?
Crawford: I think God took me out of it for good reasons and has been working on building my relationship with Laura up to the point where she is really as excited about the possibility of me playing music as I am. It's been coming back pretty strong for the past 3 or 4 years, but real strong in the last 2.
Collins: Well I'm glad to see that it has and that it is working well with your new family. It's good to have you back (on record).
Crawford: It's great to be back in some form. It's hard to know how to pursue music and support a family and all. Laura stays home with the kids which essentially the most important job in the world as far as I'm concerned, so I have to bring home the money somehow. Right now, I don't know how to make music an occupation but I will continue following the paths that God leads me down and keep putting out the music He gives to me. Hey man, thanks for taking the time to do this.
Collins: No problem at all. If you would have told Steve Collins at 18
that he was gonna interview Mike Crawford - he'd been stoked for weeks!
Crawford: Later my brother...
Collins: later...
